Nitro Transmission Update [Archive] - Dodge Nitro Forum

NitroTech

12-27-2006, 10:11 PM

As most everyone is aware there are issues with the shift quality of the Nitro transmission. A TSB is available to correct various problems with the transmission. TSB 18-037-06 FLASH: Vehicle Surge, Grumble/Drone During Torque Convertor Lockup And/Or 1-2 Part Throttle Shift Quality.

However, members are still reporting torque converter shudder as well as a transmission bog. I performed the TSB on my Nitro shortly after it was released. My vehicle has 2000kms and there is a transmission shift issue. The transmission does have torque converter shudder at 70km under light to moderate throttle. Also the 3-4 shift is poor. During this shift is appears the torque converter is locking and unlocking as well it downshifts briefly to 3 after it has shifted to 4th and then back to 4th. This is easily seen on the tach.

I sent an electronic product report to Chrysler Engineering last week reporting the transmisson shift issues. I received a call today from one of their engineers. He stated that he wants the torque converter replaced. If that doesn't cure the problem he then wants the torque converter break-in enabled.

I have not ordered the new torque converter. Instead, I performed a transmission quicklearn and re-enabled torque converter break-in. This is an experiment of mine. I want to say that enabling T/C break-in can shorten the life of the component. This will be the second time this feature is enabled. It first was enabled from the factory which is normal.

On my drive home the transmision shifting was very normal. No shudder or hunting between the 3-4 shift. I need to give this about a week, maybe less, to verify the results. It may be inevitable that the converter be replaced, but I will post my results.

If anyone has questions about this, don't hesistate to ask. I'll answer the questions I can.

DAYLEY/CHALLENGER

12-27-2006, 10:17 PM

Thanks Larry. The dealer did the Flash and Quicklearn for mine a couple of weeks ago. I still get the shudder but have accepted that I may live with it. It is only at 42 to 43 mph and usually inthe 35 mph speed limit areas.!!

bob2chee

12-28-2006, 09:07 AM

I had the torque converter replaced last week. The problem is better but still does not perform as it did new. I got the nitro and put 200 miles on it then took a 300 mile highway trip. after that the problem started. I did have the reprogramming done twice, then the torque converter replacement.

Any idea if the RT trans will fit on the 3.7 engine in the base model??

Nitro93727

12-28-2006, 10:43 AM

Larry, thanks for the update. I had this (TSB) performed last week, and am still uneasy of the hunting for gears and mild surge still present.....

NitroBilly

12-29-2006, 05:54 PM

Larry, thanks for the heads up! I had the TSB performed on mine today, and I must say it has made a noticeable difference. The tranny on my Nitro, seems to be finding the gears and changing as neccessary. No more drone noise when stepping on it and the mph hit 40-60. Somabitch rides good too! :D Service manager said the computer did show "faults" or some technical word he used which included "faults". Whatever the case, she riding now, and with plenty of giddup too.

NitroTech

12-29-2006, 09:52 PM

Hope to put some miles on the Nitro this weekend and see if things change. The transmission has been cooperating since I enabled the break-in. I'm not sure how long break-in lasts whether its timed ignition on or miles driven, but I'm sure if the transmission is gonna act up it will be after that.

That TSB only applied to vehicle built before November 17th so obviously Chrysler knows something. Those of us that still have the problem and possibly getting the torque converter changed tells me theres more to this story.

Honestly, I think Chrysler is not 100% sure what's the problem and the repair for the transmissions is at this time.

NitroBilly

12-29-2006, 10:06 PM

Yea, Chrysler is usually hush hush when they slip/miss something in the manufacturing of their cars. Only time will tell my friend. My Nitro does seem much more "responsive" to the throttle now.

DAYLEY/CHALLENGER

12-29-2006, 10:53 PM

You know I really only get the problem when I am looking for it. When starting off at a stop sign and on the gas moderately, everything shifts just fine. When I really get on it , it still does ok. Only acts up when around 42 mph and not on the gas. The clunk from 1 to 2 has disappeared too. We now have abour 3600 miles on her.

bgmz282

01-02-2007, 10:03 AM

NitroBilly

01-02-2007, 12:42 PM

Im Having This Same Problem..... The Car At About 30-40 Mph Shifts Into Overdrive. This Causes The Car To Miss And Hesitate Badly. Its Like The Car Is Shifting To Fast And Causing It To Bog Down. I Havent Taken It Yet In Fear Of Whatelse My Go Wrong. Im Hoping This Car Doesnt End Up Like The Dodge Caliber I Purchased That Gave Me Tons Of Problems Over A Course Of 8 Months And 10,000 Miles.

BGMZ, I had a Caliber too. Mines never gave me any problems though. Aside from the exhaust issue I had aft about 2200 miles. Turned out, DCX had an exhaust with a whole other design. Dealer swapped out old exhaust under warranty, Caliber was solid from there on out, til I traded it for the Nitro. But yea, after having the flash done on Friday, my nitro felt like it was shifting ok. Now it feels like the problem is back. More time wasted at the dealer....:confused:

NitroTech

01-03-2007, 08:24 PM

We had some real bad weather this past weekend which kept me from going on a longer road trip. However, in the city its shifting good and no transmission shudder. There is a torque convertor ordered for it, but if it stays the way it is I'm not putting it in. Fingers crossed.

danpfay99

01-03-2007, 09:59 PM

Hoping in stays the way it is now for you ,so in your mind did enabling the T/C break in help more than preforming only the TSB.

NitroTech

01-03-2007, 10:14 PM

Hoping in stays the way it is now for you ,so in your mind did enabling the T/C break in help more than preforming only the TSB.

So far I would say yes. However, there must have been other issues with the TSB Flash that Chrysler was trying to remedy.

Back in 2000 there were Transsmission shudder issues with the Caravans too. It was the year we switched from ATF+3 to ATF+4 and it seemed the fluid characteristics created torque converter shudder. To eliminate this break-in was enabled.

Torque converter break in is described as follows:

The break in feature burnishes the clutch material by operating the torque converter in partial Electronically Modulated Clutch Control (EMCC) for the first several hours of vehicle operation. After break in completion, the torque converter EMCC feature will operate normally.

The 42RLE Transmission is basically the same transmissions an Intrepid, 300M, Corcorde have and have been around for years and have been pretty solid.

Kinda wish that had put the 545RFE Transmission in the Nitro, the Liberty has it. Very solid transmission.

NitroTech

01-07-2007, 08:41 PM

Finally went on a little road trip this weekend. My torque converter came in on Friday, but I'm on gonna hold off on replacing it. The torque converter shudder, as compared to before, is no longer a concern. The 3-4-3 shift problem I was experiencing has also corrected itself.

For my situation I performed a Transmission Quicklearn (for the second time since the TSB was performed) and I also re-enabled Torque Converter Break-in. I do want to add that re-enabling TCC Break-in may affect the life of the component. However, at this point in time I'm not concerned with that. I feel the problem with my Nitro has been corrected at this time.

danpfay99

01-07-2007, 09:00 PM

Thats good to hear,I'm sure this news will make some other folks on the site feel better also, I'm assuming this makes you feel good.I know changing a t/c is no fun.

DAYLEY/CHALLENGER

01-07-2007, 09:15 PM

Thanks for keeping us up todate Larry. As I said before in this post I still get the shudder around 42mph with moderate gas but shifts fine if I am going thru the gears getting to road speed. We will monitor the tranny posts closely. Thanks again, David

MyWhiteNitro

01-08-2007, 05:24 AM

I drove mine for about 2 weeks and starting experiencing problems when it shifted gears. When it came time to shift it jerked into gear. I am not very knowledgable when it comes to mechanical talk, but I am learning. It has now been in the dealership for about 3 weeks. They are waiting for the torque converter to come in, but I will make mention of enabling the TC break in. Thank you for the updates. I am at the point where I'm about ready to ask the dealership for another one....but am afraid I might experience the same problems...They went into the transmission and tried repairing this by resetting or recalibrating, of course this did not work. The forum was more up to date on what was going on than the dealership that is repairing it. Any advice from anyone would be helpful.

Sherry

MyWhiteNitro

01-08-2007, 09:07 PM

Evening Everyone,

Well I got word today from the service manager that after replacing the torque converter the transmission was still not up too par. They informed me that they had ordered a new transmission and another torque converter and they should have it by Wednesday and it should be ready Thursday or Friday, but I know that it will probably not be ready until next week. They're all baffled as to what is going on. I feel like My Nitro is just being used to experiment on and I am worried about the final outcome. I Really Miss My White Nitro! So I hope the new transmission takes care of the issues, if not we will just be starting the whole process all over again. I have never had to experience these kind of problems before with purchasing a new vehicle. I am a dedicated customer of Dodge, Chrysler, and Jeep. My last two vehicles were a Chrysler Pacifica, which I miss, and the one before was a Jeep Liberty, also a great vehicle. I guess you could say I'm a Fan.

Sherry

NitroWill

01-08-2007, 09:11 PM

Hope things work out soon! Id be missing the heck out of my car..What loaner did they give you?

MyWhiteNitro

01-08-2007, 09:19 PM

The loaner they gave me was through Enterprise...its a GMC Envoy. It is a nice mid-size SUV, it handles the road pretty good, and it has some get up in it...... but its not My Nitro :(

NitroWill

01-08-2007, 09:22 PM

Not bad..well hopefully itll get sorted out and then you can really enjoy your nitro :)

danpfay99

01-08-2007, 11:22 PM

Hopefully they get it straightened out be sue to keep us posted on how things are going.:(

nicknitro

01-11-2007, 08:04 AM

Well my trans went out on the 5th. Worked fine night before. I was able to back out of driveway and put in drive. 1st and 2nd worked fine but when it tried to shift into third it acted like it had shifted into neutral. it has been in the shop since monday and i still dont know when they are going to get the parts and when they think it might be done. Me so sad... Thinking about telling me salesman i want a new one. Just bought it before xmas... 199 miles on it when i got it from dealer... just over 1k when trans died...

3.7L SXT auto trans w\tow group

cmacdo

01-11-2007, 06:07 PM

NitroTech

01-11-2007, 06:59 PM

HI, Mine did the same thing less than 72 hours after I got. they put in a new torque converter, took a week in the shop and then the next week there was fluid all over the back and it was the transfer case. Another week in the shop. Now it needs a reprograming on the transmission. But I love it anyway.

Are you aware of whether or not after the new torque converter was installed the torque converter break-in was enabled with the Starscan?

cmacdo

01-12-2007, 02:24 PM

No, but as soon as the dealer get their computer fixed they are calling me to set up a time to do all the TSB. I'm making a list from this site of things I want checked. It has been a huge help. Thanks to everyone for their input.

loriypky

01-16-2007, 04:26 PM

Sherry....Sounds as if you and I have the same deal.....I got a loaner from the local enterprise too.....I am just worn out with this whole issue...doesnt seem to be getting any better,,,,makes me want to go back to the Liberty!!!

RLMD

01-17-2007, 09:21 AM

NitroTech

01-17-2007, 06:54 PM

Hi, new to the forum. I was planning on buying a nitro soon, but the problems I have seen on this thread have made me a little apprehensive. I just wanted to know if you all think the transmission problem should be fixed as long as you buy a nitro built after november 17? Needed a new car and had my heart set on the nitro, but dont want to make a bad decision.

Thanks

Not all Nitro's built before Nov. 17 are necessarily affected. Only Chrysler will have an approximate count on how many Nitro's have this problem. The forum puts the Nitro's problems under a microscope and can make any new buyer wary of their purchase or future purchase.

Go and test drive a few of them, if they have this problem it will happen. Look for a vibration to occur at approximately 42 to 45 mph. Look on the certification placard on the drivers inside door shut face and check the production date. If you find one that doesn't have the transmission issue buy that one.

Honestly, I don't think there is a vehicle out there that is exempt from having mechanical problems. Not possible. Don't lose heart, the Nitro won't let you down.

boattech

01-17-2007, 09:39 PM

RLMD,
I agree with NitroLarry, (who is, if you didn't know, a technician on these vehicles).
Like you, I have been questioning the transmission, too much apparently, (and I own one)!
Yes there is an issue or two but they are not the kind to leave you stranded somewhere. Now I think of them as annoyances mostly!

As I re-read the posts and with some wisdom from friends like NitroLarry, I have noticed that the big problems seem to come from, lets say... less than steller Dealers...

Yes they are new vehicles, yes they are not perfect, (none are) and luckily, yes there are real qualified service facilities out there to fix em, if needed!

In my opinion, to add to NitroLarrys great suggestions about test runs and checking the production date, I'd add, check out the Dealer and their service record!
I'd buy from car from a first class dealer anytime (and wouldn't mind paying a bit more for it, for the piece of mind)!

A friend told me once; Follow your heart but use your head, It's not just a place to put your hat!

RLMD, When you get your new ride and loving every moment your in it ...(like I do) think of us here and POST some PICS! We love Pics!

Sincerely,
Frank
Nitro Owners... Party-On! :beerchug:

RLMD

01-18-2007, 07:46 AM

Frank and NitroLarry,
Thanks a lot for the excellent advice. I realize buying a new car will have its problems but I just dont want to get stuck with a lemon, its a big investment. I will probably be looking for cars in the next few weeks so I will be joining you soon. And I will definitely post some pics.

RLMD

Les

01-18-2007, 12:23 PM

DKEITH2233

01-21-2007, 10:40 AM

This is my first visit to this forum and have seen all the concerns with the trans shifting on the Nitro. My information from Chrysler is that there is a new TSB being issued on Friday Jan 26 that will addess the shifting on Nitro transmissions, unless there is a delay of some sort. A PCM flash will better control the torque converter and diminsh the shudder at 32 to 45 mph on light accell.

NitroMama

01-21-2007, 02:51 PM

I am calling the dealership again tomorrow for my peice of junk. We went to go bowling today, we had about 1 1/2 inches of snow on the road, they were a little slippery and we were on a curvy road by a lake, we were going about 25 mph and the damn this died on us, no breaks, nothing! I reached for the hazzards because there was a car right on our butts and it started back up by itself, then died agai nad then started back up again! I am so sick of this car and am now affraid to drive it. I am calling the dealership tomorrow and makeing an appointment and getting a loaner car and they can keep it till they fix it or I will look into starting a class action lawsuit. I am not going to let the dealership tell me again that there is nothing wrong with this car! Too bad it is my only car or I would tell them to take it back. I looked and my car was made in 10/06!

ppchasse

01-21-2007, 07:08 PM

DKEITH2233 How reliable is your source. Was it just Chrysler trying to make you feel better? I would love to get my tranny issues resolved. I've brought mine in already for the first TSB but still get the shudder.

Les

01-21-2007, 07:23 PM

will everyone who are having these problems with converter, transmission, surging problems say what year there nitro was made. its on the driver side door. its seems its early models that are having the problems. my nitro was made sept 2006

NitroBilly

01-21-2007, 09:30 PM

November 06 for mine. Had my dealer do the 1st update, still have the shudder problem too.

NitroMama

01-22-2007, 12:00 PM

Mine is 10/06. I am bringing mine back in today for round 2 with my dealership on these issues. Will let you all know what they try to tell me this time. I will not let them tell me again that they drove it and they did not notice anything and that the computer says it's fine.

NitroMama

01-22-2007, 01:16 PM

Well I dropped it off again. The guy I talked to said it could be some sort of sensor thing, I highly doubt it! So we shall see.......:shakehead: :(

ppchasse

01-22-2007, 05:37 PM

Mine is was built 11/06. Mine is in the shop again. I'm getting the run around that they took it out for 10 miles and couldn't find anything.:loser1:

DKEITH2233

01-22-2007, 07:34 PM

my source is a chrysler tech rep who was in contact with detroit
--they are aware of this problem and believe this is the fix---
i'll be sure to let you know after the tsb comes out and try it on a few vehicles

ppchasse

01-22-2007, 08:18 PM

Thanks, I'm sorry if it sounded like I was doubting you. I have been having problems with my dealership and this transmission problem. Thanks for the info though this forum is nice, but frustrating when the forum knows more about issues before the dealership does.:shakehead:

Nitro Mark

01-23-2007, 11:23 AM

Hey Everyone,
I just spoke to a dodge tech that said by the 26th dodge is sending an additive treatment for the transmission, some sort of a defoaming agent along with a special lubricant that when added along with the new programing is working nicely. Lets keep our fingers crossed on this one, 'cause I sure love our nitro.
Mark :4-jump2:

ppchasse

01-23-2007, 04:55 PM

I went to the dealer this morning to bring the tech for a ride. They brought it out and couldn't find the problem. Before I even said what it was doing he said exactly what we have talking about. This whole torque converter problem? Humm I guess no one seems to talk to anyone in my dealership.(techs and service managers). I don't know if they know about the fix that is suppose to come out on the 26th. But they are keeping overnight again. I guess I'll ride the 05 Liberty they loaned me while it's in the shop.:i_rolleyes: :Racing:

NitroMama

01-23-2007, 05:11 PM

Mine is in the shop right now for repairs on the issue with it dieing on you while you are driveing it, they called me this afternoon and asked if the tech could drive it home tonight and back to the shop tomorrow morning. They said they found a few issues with it and traced it down to an electrical thing where it is not getting enough juice to keep it running so they pulled a part out of a showroom floor nitro and put it in mine. They want to take it for a longer ride to see if this corrected the problem I an haveing with mine and they will call me in the morning to let me know if it happens or not. I am so hopeing that it corrected this problem because I cannot deal with the stress headaches that I have getting every day from this! I am also going to talk to the salesman that leased us thi car and see if he can add back onto our lease agreement all of the miles that they had put on my car the past 2 times it was in on the test drives that has equiled up to 200 miles! Plus they are going to have to fill my tank because my car had enough gas in it for at least one day of driveing so they would have been on walk sometimes while it was there. I asked him if the peice they replaced would also cause it to die while turning into tight spots and the shuddering problem and he said it could be but this guys did not sound too sure. So we shall see come tomorrow. So far I have been happy in the 2006 Jeep Comander that I got as a loaner, I love that car and am sad to give it back now!

Donna

01-28-2007, 05:24 PM

NitroTech

01-28-2007, 06:00 PM

Hi I'm Donna from Burlington. What about this new additive for the transmission that Nitro Mark is talking about? Is it out yet? My dealer doesn't know anything about it.
Please let me know, I want to get my Nitro fixed!

What Nitro Mark posted is the first I've heard that part of the repair for the upcoming TSB addressing the transmission torque converter shudder includes using an additive. The TSB isn't expected to be out until sometime in early February.

For sometime now Chrysler has had an anti-foaming transmission fluid agent, it's not new. Wait and see what the TSB entails. I'll be posting it as soon as it is published.

amazeau

01-28-2007, 06:22 PM

Is this since the fixed the problem with the starter turning overe and over without starting? I still have mine in the shop and they are replacing the computer and the fuel pump. parts are on backorder and won't be available until Tuesdat January 30th. Pleas let me know how you make out.

Nitro Mark

01-30-2007, 07:10 AM

I now have about 250 miles on mine since the new flash and adding the defoaming agent. So far so good, I am keeping my fingers crossed.
Mark

boattech

01-30-2007, 07:08 PM

Best of luck, Nitro Mark!
We are counting on you to reply to this thread when you put some miles behind you!
Frank

Nitro Mark

02-01-2007, 01:52 PM

danpfay99

02-01-2007, 11:20 PM

Thanks for the update Nitro Mark will be having that done in like two weeks.

NitroTech

02-02-2007, 07:29 AM

I have put about another 500 miles on our Nitro and the transmission still seems ok. It still has a little jerk under hard shifting, but i've owned dodges for years and they all seemed to do that. Unless you are having a major problem check into the fix I got. I hope it helps..........
Mark:4-jump2:

Not sure where you are getting your information but I'm not seeing where Chrysler asks for the addition of a anti-foaming agent or special additive with the new flash for the torque converter shudder???

Nitro Mark

02-02-2007, 12:11 PM

Nitro Larry,
The tech's at Sheets Dodge just outsude of Beckley, WV said they recieved this additional info after speaking with Chrysler engineering. I am in no way trying to act as if I know it all, but so far it is working for me so could care less who come up with the idea. I just know that now I am enjoying my nitro even more. It however does make sense to add this kind of an agent. I am not a service tech but I have built a few motors from the ground up over the years (Ford, Dodge & Chevy) and a lot of simple tranny problems start and end with fluid. If aint lubed proper it aint gonna go...................Mark

NitroTech

02-03-2007, 11:26 AM

The transmission has been around for years just in a different configuration. The 42RLE started its life as a 42LE and was found in the first LH cars (Intrepid, Concorde, LHS) with the 3.5L engine. Since then there have running changes.

It's been modified for rear wheel drive and all-wheel drive setups.

I think an important question would be who builds the torque converters? Is it Chrysler or do they have a out of plant supplier. Many components on vehicles are not built my the actual manufacturer. Chrysler just assembles the pieces.

For an example, visit the VW forum and you'll find after doing a search on ignition coils you'll find those owners have had huge problems with that particular component. The supplier is Bosch. Bosch is a leading manufacturer of electrical components. There are some Bosch components in your Nitro. In the end customers complaints are directed at VW and not Bosch. Indirectly its not VW's fault but they have customers with cars that won't run properly because of faulty coils provided by Bosch.

The company Dana used to supply almost all Chrysler axles. A few years back the Jeep Grand Cherokee's experienced problems with driveline noise that eventually was traced back to incorrectly machined axle housings. Today you'll find most Chrysler axles are supplied by American axle.

There are also Nitro owners here that are experiencing electrical problems. The Chrysler 300, Magnum, and Chargers also experience electrical problems. What I want everyone to know is that there are alot of Mercedes-Benz stamped electrical parts that can be found in these vehicles. Just because a Mercedes has a high price tag doesn't mean that the manufacturer produces superior components. Most expensive vehicles doesn't mean higher quality.

Toyota is not exempt. 533,000 Toyota Sequoia SUV's and Tundra pickups are being recalled for defective steering components makig them difficult to steer. Six injuries and 11 accidents were reported as a result of the defect.

Recalls have also been on the rise across the industry as car makers use common components on various models to save costs.

StudebakerJoe

07-13-2007, 09:19 AM

Larry,

I have had the torque converter replaced, all TSB flashes completed, the AT fluid replaced, and G25 recall performed and the Nitro still shudders. The last time the Service Manager drove my Nitro and noted the shudder. We then drove a new Nitro from the lot and it did the same thing. He reported to the Chrysler Customer Rep that this is a characteristic of the Nitro. I assume that means that this can not be fixed. This is unacceptable. Do you have any more suggestions on a repair? I am desparate.:mad:

Thanks

NitroTech

07-13-2007, 07:16 PM

Joe

This is the latest info I've got. This is a driving style issue and is currently under investigation. The transmission control module (TCM) software allows the torque converter clutch to engage at relatively low engine RPM when driving with very light throttle. This condition may be more pronounced when driving up a slight incline. No corrective action process is available at this time.

Possible TCM flash update may be developed. TSB or other service publication may be published when corrective action process is defined.

Many different reports have come out of Chrysler on this Nitro torque converter shudder. First, I heard the torque converters were faulty due to warpage. Not to sure what they were saying was warped, maybe the stator?? Basically a torque converter is fluid coupling in a two element drive that is incapable of multiplying torque, while a torque converter has at least one extra element—the stator—which alters the drive's characteristics during periods of high slippage, producing an increase in output torque.

I think the problem is the excessive slippage due to low line pressure. The shudder is a result of excessive slippage. If you remember reading the TSB along with replacing the torque converter, a flash reprogram was to be performed and once that was done the VLP (variable line pressure) was supposed to be reset, along with enabling torque converter break-in.

I suspect when break-in is enabled line pressure is increased. My Nitro was experiencing shudder and when I enabled break-in the shudder disappeared.

I intend to take some data recordings of the transmission in the near future to see what is going and hopefully something significant will be revealed. In the meantime make your dealer aware of the transmission problems.

snaus32

07-17-2007, 07:41 PM

We've had ours in the shop 3 times for the tranny issues all tsbs performed and the techs admitt to still fealing the shutter and surginging. I was told that the tq was in spec what ever that means and we have to live with it until chrysler figures something out. we also had radio problems. I'm getting out of this junker asap. Worst vehicle ever owned.:(

Nitro93727

07-18-2007, 11:08 AM

I too am experiencing many problems. After 3 attempts at fixing the tranny and still more needed, plus a list of other problems, it maybe time for the lemon to go away.

Nitr010507

07-18-2007, 11:37 AM

How do you get them to re-enable the break in? I've mentioned it once to the tech that replaced my torque converter, his response was " it comes from the factory enabled..we don't need to re-enable it. Another time to an SM at another dealership and he totally acted like he didn't know what I was talking about. When I try to mention this site..I get a speech about this isn't an official Chrysler or Dodge site, so I shouldn't pay any attention to what I read on here. ha ha...I found that hilarious because if it weren't for this site I would be completely lost. I really feel if the service techs and SM's from the dealerships would read some of the information on this site from the techs they might learn something.

At least here you don't get the "that's normal for a nitro" crap.

SeattleJoe

01-25-2008, 03:41 PM

At least here you don't get the "that's normal for a nitro" crap.

LOL!!! I've already gotten that, and I haven't even had my Nitro for a month yet!:i_rolleyes:

-------------------------

addeneum: I mean, I've already gotten that from the dealership people!

BlueJet

01-25-2008, 03:49 PM

Hey! Welcome to the forum! :wavey: Glad you joined! You should go introduce yourself in the newbie thread! Nice to have another Seattle person around!

canadianlimey

01-25-2008, 04:38 PM

LOL!!! I've already gotten that, and I haven't even had my Nitro for a month yet!:i_rolleyes:

Welcome Joe, glad you're here. As the multi talented BlueJet said, head over to the newbie section and say HI to us all.....

SeattleJoe

01-28-2008, 06:04 AM

I sent an electronic product report to Chrysler Engineering last week reporting the transmisson shift issues.

Uh..... silly question, but just how do you DO that???

:confused:

MeanGirl

01-28-2008, 08:05 AM

Uh..... silly question, but just how do you DO that???

:confused:
Nitrotech is an employee of sorts and he knows stuff we can't or he would not be special anymore....lol. really tho, he is just that a "tech" and knows the industry ins and outs

nitrouk

01-28-2008, 01:17 PM

hi
can anybody tell me if the torque converter in the crd diesel is the same as the 3.7l /4.0l nitros or are they different.
thanks

fhartell

01-28-2008, 05:19 PM

This is not for the R/T is it?

canadianlimey

01-28-2008, 05:28 PM

hi
can anybody tell me if the torque converter in the crd diesel is the same as the 3.7l /4.0l nitros or are they different.
thanks

I'll try to find out for you. I know the 3.7 and 4.0 liter have different tranny's so I would think the torque converter ids different too.

nitrouk

01-28-2008, 05:37 PM

thanks canadianlimey much apprieated

BluNitro

01-28-2008, 06:34 PM

Many different reports have come out of Chrysler on this Nitro torque converter shudder. First, I heard the torque converters were faulty due to warpage. Not to sure what they were saying was warped, maybe the stator?? Basically a torque converter is fluid coupling in a two element drive that is incapable of multiplying torque, while a torque converter has at least one extra element—the stator—which alters the drive's characteristics during periods of high slippage, producing an increase in output torque.

I think the problem is the excessive slippage due to low line pressure. The shudder is a result of excessive slippage. If you remember reading the TSB along with replacing the torque converter, a flash reprogram was to be performed and once that was done the VLP (variable line pressure) was supposed to be reset, along with enabling torque converter break-in.

Hi all!

I (unfortunately) worked with torque converters for nearly 20yrs. I can tell you most of the time these probs have very little to do with the TC (torque converter) itself.
If anything is "warped" it will be the clutch piston, surface or mating surface inside the front cover of the TC. This would give you a fairy quick degradation of the clutch lining and apply performance straight away.
The lining itself is a whole other ball game. Originally these linings were made of "organic" material - red in colour - for applications where clutch was applied on/off. These days it's more common to see a carbon based lining as modern transmissions control their clutches in a "gradual apply/release" fashion.
The paradox of these two linings are that an organinc lining has the best "bite" for on/off applications but degrades very quicky under gradual applications. Carbon is far more "slippery" which unfortunately enatails any form of slippage = fritction = heat = possible degradations of the lining and warpage/hotspots on the mating clutch surface.
Various types of carbon mix linings are being used (trialled) in modern gradual apply/release (also known as PWM; pulse with modulation or EC3) transmissions across the board to find a happy medium for the manufacturers transmissions.
On top of all this, the TCC (torque converter clutch) is just a "dumb" piston! By "dumb" i mean has no control by itself on within the TC to apply or release or its needed pressures. Its all controlled by the valve body and pump valves in the trans which are controlled and monitored by electronic means (ECU, ECC, TCU etc). An ECU that's programmed to engage the TCC at too low a speed will load the TCC and as it is incabable of holding the load, breaks free and grabs again. This happens rapidly in tenths of a secong and produces your shudder.
Over the years i have worked with TC probs from models from as far back as 1987 with these same lame (shuddering) ECU codes that no-one bothered to reprogram. We would have to try to come up with a happy medium to make these cars work like altering the with/size of the surface area of the clutch and/or use different materials such as Kevlar for the clutch material.

The other side of this can be probs in the valve body ... uuh lets not go into that ... I haven't heard of changing/updating valve bodies as a fix for this late version of this trans ....

Hopefully they will sort it out electronically, replacing the TCs that dont have the correct clutch material for this application on the way.

Here's a good Wiki on torque converters for anyone who wants to have a look-see,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torque_converter

Cheers,
BN

DrTaz

02-06-2008, 09:27 AM

Great summary on TCs, BluNitro! I learned something today!:rep:

SeattleJoe

02-08-2008, 02:55 PM

Nice to have another Seattle person around!

Hi, BlueJet ..... are you in the Seattle area, or from the Seattle area? (I see a CA tag with your name.)

I'll have to get a shot of my custom WA plates when I receive the new "WA National Parks" one ... it'll go nicely with my silver paint job!

SeattleJoe

02-08-2008, 03:02 PM

Well, i got an appointment at a different dealership ... they realize I'm "shopping" for a place to service my new Nitro.

A tech rode along this morning with the computer attached. I claimed the engine bogs down when the TC engages early (sometimes at 25mph) ... he says it feels more like the shudder that so many Nitro owners complain about.

Got a call from the dealership ... they flashed the system (saying that sometimes the updates don't "take") ... and the shudder became much more noticeable.

So, a new TC is on order (from Orlando) ... we'll see what that does for my rig.

I really feel these people are much more responsive and receptive ... sure their hands are tied (there aren't any "tweaks" they can perform ... it's all pre-programmed) ... but they are trying!

:smileup:

SeattleJoe

02-15-2008, 03:02 PM

For my situation I performed a Transmission Quicklearn (for the second time since the TSB was performed) and I also re-enabled Torque Converter Break-in.

What exactly is a "Transmission Quicklearn" and what transmissions would it apply to?

:confused:

SeattleJoe

02-15-2008, 03:18 PM

The transmission control module (TCM) software allows the torque converter clutch to engage at relatively low engine RPM when driving with very light throttle. This condition may be more pronounced when driving up a slight incline. No corrective action process is available at this time.

Wow, I missed this post before ......... this almost perfectly describes my main "issue" with my Nitro (as noted in several other threads ... sorry!)

The rig is currently in the shop for a new Torque Converter (hopefully the New And Improved model) ... and I'll let y'all know what the results are ... and we have a 3-day weekend coming up, so another day to test the car! I should consider a bit of a road trip to test it out huh? (Maybe just up Hwy 2 to Stevens Pass, if it's not closed because of snow and avalanche danger!)

If all goes well, I could be One Happy Camper very soon!!!

:cool:

stuffer

05-11-2008, 10:54 AM

SeattleJoe

05-11-2008, 03:24 PM

I am having the same problem with bogging down and shudder at about 40 to 42 mph. I see where a lot of you have taken your Nitro in for repairs. Mine has 38,000 mile on it. Is Dodge covering any of these repairs under the TSB?. I feel that if this is a on going problem with many Nitros why won't Dogde/Chrysler fix the problem at no charge.

Hiya!

It would seem that the "shudder" issue is ongoing. What's more is some people have the "shudder" problem, others don't. Those that go in for repairs due to the shudder issue sometimes come out with a worse shudder. Go figure.

I hear rumors that Chrysler is working on something, but can't say anything about it. Too bad, it would be nice to know that they actually acknowledge the problem and are indeed working on it.

SeattleJoe

05-11-2008, 03:31 PM

Wow, I missed this post before ......... this almost perfectly describes my main "issue" with my Nitro (as noted in several other threads ... sorry!)

The rig is currently in the shop for a new Torque Converter (hopefully the New And Improved model) ... and I'll let y'all know what the results are ... and we have a 3-day weekend coming up, so another day to test the car! I should consider a bit of a road trip to test it out huh? (Maybe just up Hwy 2 to Stevens Pass, if it's not closed because of snow and avalanche danger!)

If all goes well, I could be One Happy Camper very soon!!!

:cool:

Okay, here are some results.

The Torque Converter got replaced, back in February, I went for a drive, all seemed okay.

However, I think the TC had a "break-in" period ... on top of that, my transmission's computer was doing it's actual "learning" of my driving habits during stop-slow rush-hour driving!

Well, a week ago friday, the dealership re-flashed the tranny programming and bumped it back into "Quick Learn" mode. I then proceeded to "Drive It Like I Stole It". Got about 200 miles on the clock while driving it harder than usual, paying special attention to the 25-35mph range.

Seems to have worked. The transmission now shifts better. Not perfectly, but better. It's not so quick to engage the torque converter at lower speeds, and tends to unlock a bit easier now. Downshifts seem to be a bit easier. Seems to have learned a more aggressive style of driving, which is what I wanted.

So, it'll do okay, until Chrysler comes up with some proper fixes.

APOLLO

05-11-2008, 06:14 PM

FYI: I had all the typical nitro transmission issues and it eventually died as some of you know:i_rolleyes:, now with my brand new out of the crate transmission I have had no problems what so ever! So for anyone who wants to spend $4,000 you can have a shudder free nitro too.:smileup:

petey

05-11-2008, 08:35 PM

Hiya!

I hear rumors that Chrysler is working on something, but can't say anything about it.

TEASE!!!! What did you hear? Huh? Huh?? C'mon, share the wealth!!

SeattleJoe

05-11-2008, 08:36 PM

TEASE!!!! What did you hear? Huh? Huh?? C'mon, share the wealth!!

Sorry ..... I meant I'd heard they were working on something and THEY can't say anything! (After re-reading the sentence, I see it could be taken either way!)

:o

petey

05-11-2008, 09:12 PM

Sorry ..... I meant I'd heard they were working on something and THEY can't say anything! (After re-reading the sentence, I see it could be taken either way!)

:o
Bah...what a gyp!!:chuckle:

Quiet Lunatic

08-13-2008, 03:38 PM

Bah...what a gyp!!:chuckle:
had torqe replaced 1 month ago(have 30000ks on vehicle)shuder still with me, took to dealer and chrysler rep they had for 4 days brought it back and claimed road vibration. which is bull****. at the same time they where to fix heater isue, which they did not. thought about trading , was offered 16000, unit is 1 year old payed 34000, quite a kik in the you know wher. some posters critical of my complaints well i will be heracing chrysler ,and posting results.good info on this subject. need a class action to wake chrysler up. cliff

snaus32

10-06-2008, 08:14 PM

had torqe replaced 1 month ago(have 30000ks on vehicle)shuder still with me, took to dealer and chrysler rep they had for 4 days brought it back and claimed road vibration. which is bull****. at the same time they where to fix heater isue, which they did not. thought about trading , was offered 16000, unit is 1 year old payed 34000, quite a kik in the you know wher. some posters critical of my complaints well i will be heracing chrysler ,and posting results.good info on this subject. need a class action to wake chrysler up. cliff

Cliff I'm with you!!! I just contacted a lemon law firm for mine and gave them this website for research. Maybe when they see how many of os are suffering they will start something with a class action. Mine was in 6 times with all tsbs thanks to me per this site. Dealer was clueless and also tq and tsb, still there called chryler and had a rep take the car for the day and he says its no problem found shutter occurs when trans is in lock up for better fuel economy! lol we average 14-16. this is bullshit 7 times is it going lemon wish me luck.

Dave


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