Coil Pack/misfire Question

Discussion in 'Dodge Nitro Electrical Problems and Questions' started by dnickerson, Nov 4, 2017.

  1. dnickerson

    dnickerson New Member

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    Hey guys,

    My 2009 Nitro is throwing me a misfire code and I'd love some tips on if I'm heading on the right path.

    Backstory - the CEL came on the other week and threw codes P0300 & P0306 saying random misfire and cylinder 6 misfire. I don't know how long ago the plugs were changed and assumed it would be needed. We replaced the plugs and cylinder 6 plug was definitely bad. Truck ran a bit smoother but than threw the CEL again the same day and only code P0306 now.

    The wires all look to be in good shape, but the coil pack on cylinder 3 has a broken clip on the top where the connector plugs in to. This means it doesn't actually snap in to place like the others.

    Before I go and replace the coil pack, can that cause an issue? It only throws the code once you start driving and the engine does have a bit of a shake to it compared to before the CEL.

    Thanks!
     
  2. Scar0

    Scar0 Khaki Nitro Nut Moderator Member Relations NOTM Winner!

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    Yep that could definitely cause the misfire. Inspect the plug holes and pins for arc damage.
    Also, only use cheap plugs in the 3.7 Nitro. The 3.7 hates platinum plugs, they will only cause you problems.
    NGK ZFR6F-11G is what I use.
     
  3. dnickerson

    dnickerson New Member

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    Thanks Scar0. I was hoping I was on the right track for diagnosing it.

    I knew that about the platinums so I've got coppers in there now. When we swapped the plugs out, the one from cylinder 6 was definitely showing signs of the plug not firing at all. So it's got a new one in there with the proper gap and its certainly running better than before. But I know the coil pack that has the clip broke is on the other end of the wire. So it sounds like I'm on the right track. Phew that's good to hear lol.
     
  4. Scar0

    Scar0 Khaki Nitro Nut Moderator Member Relations NOTM Winner!

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    If that plug was really carboned up you may need to run a cleaner thru the system because the valves++ will be just as bad.
    Pull the intake air hose and clean the throttle body(engine off first, and again with the engine running. Next (engine running) disconnect the brake booster vacuum hose from the booster side, and induce some seafoam (or similar) into the brake booster vacuum hose. (you will see whitish smoke coming out the exhaust from the above, and it may also cause a CEL.)
    Finally fill your tank with gas and add a can of seafoam (or similar) to the tank. Till the seafoam in the tank is worked thru, you may notice slightly less power.

    It may also be a good idea to replace the 3 plug wires. Just to be safe.

    If the compression it OK, then it could also be a failing injector causing the misfire. Which could also lead to a lot of carbon buildup.
     
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  5. EG1

    EG1 New Member

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    I've heard that the 3.7 uses copper plugs not platinum plugs because it will set off misfire codes
     
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  6. Scar0

    Scar0 Khaki Nitro Nut Moderator Member Relations NOTM Winner!

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    You are correct. 3.7 uses the cheap NGK ZFR6F-11G plugs.
     
  7. dnickerson

    dnickerson New Member

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    Quick update.

    The spark plugs I used were copper ones and they definitely are running nice. I did swap out the coil pack with a brand new piece and it instantly fixed the rough running issue, the CEL light, and cleared up all misfire codes. For those in Canada I bought the coil pack at PartSource and it was about $85 taxes in (I'm in Ontario). Took me about 15 minutes to swap the part and reattach the wires/battery terminal. Started the truck up and she was purring like a kitten :)

    Thanks for all the advise guys! Hugely appreciate it!!!
     
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  8. Kevcosta

    Kevcosta New Member

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    R/T "Misfire" code continues ! I'd like to piggy-back onto this thread . . . I hope people notice and can help.
    Same exact problem as dnickerson. Same solution: Replaced coil pack on cylinder diagnosed as "Misfiring" AND all spark plugs. Solved. For a couple weeks ! Flashing CEL comes on...runs rough...light goes off after a week or so...runs fine. Now it's on again, for the same cylinder and I'm guessing it's something other than plugs, coil, wires, etc. Some "module", "sensor", "short" ? ? ?

    YOUR thoughts ?
    Appreciated !
     
  9. EG1

    EG1 New Member

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    Do you own a Scanner with the capabilities of reading live data? If so, have you looked at the Fuel Trim Numbers and O2 Sensor Signals? Those signals there will point you in the right direction to what type of "Misfire" the vehicle is having. Ignition misfires will tend to have Low Positive Fuel Trim numbers. Injector problems tend to have Higher Positive Fuel Trim numbers but there is a Variable because if the O2 Sensor Signals are bad then the Short Term Fuel Trim & Long Term Fuel Trim numbers are wrong because everything is reactive accordingly to O2 Sensor Signals.
     
  10. EG1

    EG1 New Member

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    Continued from my other post......

    Lean conditions could be:

    Vacuum Leak
    Low Fuel Pressure
    Dirty Mass Air Flow or Map Sensor
    Plugged Injector

    Rich conditions could be:

    Leaking Fuel Pressure Regulator

    *Changing RPMs while watching Fuel Trim numbers would give you an idea of what type of Vacuum Leak present. Also an Intake Manifold Runner Gasket will give a cylinder misfire. A catalytic converter could be clogged.
     
  11. EG1

    EG1 New Member

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    Continued.....

    Positive Fuel Trim numbers is a Rich command in response to a Lean Condition.( for example could be due to a small leak on the EGR stem area)

    Negative Fuel Trim numbers is a Lean command in response to a Rich condition.

    Properly working O2 sensor signals oscillate Rich to Lean. Signal amplitude range is 200 to 800. It is not uncommon to see 100 to 900.

    O2 Sensor signals only operate in Closed Loop. On a scanner when checking O2's make sure it's in closed loop to interpret signal data.

    Severe Ignition misfires will drive the O2 sensor signal very lean and fuel trims very positive.

    The ideal LTFT numbers are at 0% but they are allowed a tolerance of +/- 10% considered normal. If you see a number of +/- 5 -7 it's okay because you probably won't find the cause for that. BUT you might want to look at these numbers due to symptoms of misfires.

    STFT issues will show in the LTFT numbers.

    LTFT numbers are to keep the STFT close to 0% as possible.
     
  12. Kevcosta

    Kevcosta New Member

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    Wow ! Thanks a LOT...for ALL that EG1. I personally do NOT have "a Scanner with the capabilities of reading live data". But I have a Friend who does...and I think, with all of this information you've shared...well, we've got some direction now. GOOD direction it sounds like. I'll let you and "y'all" know what happens for us...maybe it can help others...
     
  13. EG1

    EG1 New Member

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    Learning how to properly interpret LTFT and STFT Fuel Trim along with O2 Sensor Signal Data will save you a ton of money and headaches on any vehicle you own.

    *Upstream O2 Sensor signals will oscillate Up & Down, Rich to Lean, on the graph. Upstream O2 Sensor Signals are not supposed to be fixed (stuck) Rich or Lean. The numbers should change rapidly from 200 to 800 sometimes 100 to 900.

    Downstream O2 Sensor Signals are not supposed to mimic the Upstream O2 Sensor Signals. Downstream O2 Sensor Signals stay steady on the graph and change numbers slowly. If the Downstream O2 Sensor Signals mimics the Upstream O2 Sensor Signals these are indications you might have an issue with the Catalytic Converter(possibly clogged).

    The Downstream O2 Sensors don't impact the drivability of the vehicle. Hopefully you find the issues at hand and Godspeed!
     
  14. EG1

    EG1 New Member

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    When fixing issues using Fuel Trim Numbers and O2 Sensor Signals don't be so quick to delete the codes. Check your Data again and compare to the previous data to see if the problem is fixed and then delete the codes. Please note that after the repairs are complete and the Codes are erased from memory, the Check Engine Light may come back on even if all the Fuel Trim/O2 data is correct .This is due to the different cells in the computer memory that have to be "Re-learned". It's a drive cycle process. During the alotted time from the misfire issue to when the repair was done, there was a domino effect from the misfire and changed other parameters/cells in order to compensate for the misfire errors. So all these other cells need to change again with the new repairs. This is why some vehicles have to be driven a certain amount of miles for the computer to erase the codes from memory.
     
  15. EG1

    EG1 New Member

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    I've read, heard and seen( but not advocating) that when changing out faulty O2 Sensors on Chryslers, aftermarket O2 Sensors is not recommended. OE (Original Equipment) O2 Sensors are recommended on Chryslers. I'm not saying you have a faulty O2 Sensor just passing the word. Same thing goes for GM vehicles (AC-Delco) . I might say that when changing out any Informational Input Sensor(s) you might want to use OE equipment when financially capable. OE Sensor/Input equipment parameters are set to the "original programmer" of your vehicles computer system. "Bad input equals a bad output".
     
  16. Kevcosta

    Kevcosta New Member

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    OK EG1...thanks for that too. This is also helpful.
     

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